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Playstation 4 Pro Black Friday Deals 2019
Welcome to our regular scheduled content our show of the week digital foundry direct I’m Richard Ledbetter and joining me to discuss what we’ve been up to this week and a pretty key topic that we’ve been kind of thinking about it for a while it’s John liniment hey rich how’s it going today it’s absolutely brilliant thank you very much what about you it’s going wonderfully excited to be here as always it’s been a fun week we have a lot of stuff to talk about
I need closure I need closure when your twin Famicom did you fix it oh yes yes that I fixed it it’s all good that was a fun project so you know obviously I managed to get it for cheap but it was broken that’s the thing it’s like okay this doesn’t work and it’s dirty yeah here it is so you know it’s fun to take an old console that’s been put up for adoption bring it home with you care for it you know caress it so yeah I mean I cleaned it up restored the family come aside easy obviously the family come this system side was broken so what I did actually was sort of obtain another Famicom disk system and I sort of put the two side-by-side and kind of went through the calibration process and very carefully sort of tried to figure out what worked on the working unit versus what didn’t on the broken unit because you’re really like inserting a little allen wrench kind of thing through the front of the unit and it’s it’s a pain and I eventually got that working then I also had to desolder and resolder the AV connections because they work very loose and producing bad results Wow I also fixed the controllers had to replace some of the the rubber inside the controller so buttons didn’t work correctly now it works like a champ I mean it’s just kind of a fun little piece to have so I can play all those family comic disk system games right from the disk or you know regular Famicom games and cartridge though from my actual family come playing I usually just use the analog and T mini still mmm it’s just you know that’s that’s a really great system for that so but this is nice to have as well good well I’m kind of happy that there’s a happy ending to that story so what else you been up to this week and yeah well I have something else coming out soon that we can’t talk about right now as one this gives up so I did do something fun that you’ll know about sitting right but then in addition to that I spent a lot of time covering and playing the game blazing chrome I think we’ll have a video up for that soon that’s basically a contra style game if you will like this is this is the contra sequel I’ve been waiting for for a long time basically and it was extremely exciting to play it turned out really really good I was very impressed and then what impressed me more as I randomly reached out to the lead developer on it just on Twitter you know as he do send in message hey you want to talk about your game how you made it and he turned out to be just super nice and talkative and shared all kinds of development assets with me and just sort of you know shared their process of building a game like this and the sort of restrictions that they placed upon themselves to ensure that it felt like a real period-appropriate sort of arcade game and I think they pulled it off so that’s that’s a good one well I’ve already seen that content so I’m really looking forward to seeing the response to it because I think it was pretty good stuff as for me well I’ve been with Rison this week oh yes you can see the horizon yes I don’t want to say about that other than AMD have done a really good job and still Intel for gaming for my money but are we gonna ship out and about some of the third gen rise and parts to Alex who will be doing the long term testing on that and based on what I’ve seen gen on gen comparing the 2nd gens of the 3rd gen I think he’s going to be quite happy bearing in mind that he’s still on the first gen so yeah that’s pretty good I believe next week actually the embargo is up for the r-tx 28th super which not sure if I can say whether I’ve got it or not but we will have a review for the 23rd hopefully so yes that’s going to be really interesting stuff that kind of vinyl furlong of the super saga and beyond that huge backlog this is exciting I got a big shipment of games in here’s a pic look at this I buy weird stuff I finally got a complete inbox mint-condition copy of Naughty Dog’s way of the warrior Wow not their first game not even close but this is it’s a special game alright and now it’s mine I’ll tell you what’s mine is this special invitation to Nvidia’s quake to RTX launch that they did this week in London don’t really usually talk much about PR bumps but this is really quite interesting it’s just like a reimagining of physical reimagining of the original quake to retail products but here it is in RTX I know you’ve been enviously eyeing that yes I would like to put that next to my actual copy of quake – okay well look let’s move on to the matter in hand and it’s kind of a topic that we’ve been discussing internally for months now which is simply PlayStation 4 Pro I think it’s time to reappraise it not as we originally did as a 4k machine but as a 1080p machine because I think developers are really pushing the PlayStation hardware so hard now that you kind of need extra overhead and time and time again we’re actually seeing that if you’re gaming at 1080p as opposed to 4k having a ps4 Pro is a big big advantage and I guess the thing that kind of brought it back to my mind was your recent blood-stained coverage yeah so you’re absolutely right and it’s something I’ve really noticed this year a lot of ps4 pro games aren’t coming anywhere near hitting 4k where as base ps4 games now are more often falling below 1080p not all the time yeah we’re seeing more of that so in a sense the original ps4 you’re just not getting as much native 1080p content anymore where’s what the pro pretty much everything is always going to be 1080p minimum or you get down scaling from a higher resolution and this is pretty interesting because unlike the Xbox there isn’t a universal solution for every game you’re not limited to say okay if you select no matter what you select on Xbox it’s always going to render at the Scorpio resolution if you will yeah right mm-hmm whereas in the pro we know changing settings around can change the resolution and the performance impact that the resolution has on the game and so in a way you’re just kind of getting oftentimes the ps4 Pro offers the best performing version of any single game just because of the fact that you can run it at 1080p like one example I want to give real quick Red Faction gorilla I tested recently you remember that one yeah yeah sure I played it on xbox and it was really really impressive but it’s smoother still on the pro isn’t it lower resolution but yes and no that’s the this is what really hits the top of home for me if you play it at 1080p it’s the smoothest of all the console versions but if you play it at native 4k which is an option the frame rate is so low that it rivals list of battle mage in its original form we’re talking like low teens here it gets terrible so this is a case where it’s both the best and the worst performing version depending on your resolution choice but if you’ve got your ps4 Pro set to 1080p at the front end then you’re gonna get the best performing version of that game correct well is quite interesting isn’t it but I guess the big question is if you’ve already got a standard PlayStation 4 is a big upgrade to move over to the pro 7 so this is actually something I’ve I’ve seen a lot of people asking about this at various stores and just people I’ve met saying hey I’ve only got a 1080p TV why would I get the pro and in a sense I think that if you have a 1080p it’s almost makes more sense to get the pro yeah than anything else just just for the fact that the games are just they do almost universally run better on the ps4 Pro and the pro seems to be the margit on the playstation side more often than not Wow so yeah I do I do think 1080p owners are almost getting the better experience if you have a 4k TV and you’re buying multi-platform games then I’d say in most cases the Xbox one X is going to be the choice for that show because you are getting high resolution games on average most of them are at or relatively close to 4k I’d say that’s very common on the X whereas on the pro it isn’t that common and as we said you often sacrifice performance so in that sense if you’re playing at 1080p probably getting the best performance mmm yeah and I think we also talked about a few other games we’re playing at 1080p on the pro makes a huge difference another one you did recently was rage – yeah which is like a night and day difference 30 frames per second on base 60 frames per second on the Enhanced machine and it’s not a perfect 60 but it’s pretty close it’s yeah exactly that’s another that’s a really good one it is very close to being a stable 60 most of the time on the pro versus just thirty on the base ps4 it’s a night and day difference there mm-hmm it looks basically the same but the difference in performance is significant yeah and another one which which brings to mind dangerous driving brilliant game oh yeah brilliant game but I can’t really consider the the base consoles for that one because well you know if you’re going to do a spiritual successor to burnout burnouts always been a 60 Hertz game and you know again another night and day difference by playing that brilliant game on ps4 pro as opposed to the base unit yeah and what’s interesting about that as I just saw a tweet from someone suggesting that they’ve patched the game on base ps4 to fix the bed frame pacing oh really so I need to check this but even if they do fix that you’re still looking at 30 FPS versus 60 so it’s kind of a night and day difference before it was like 30 FPS was bad frame pacing versus 60 why would you ever play the base version but if they fix that then at least it’s a little more reasonable but ultimately not really it’s not the way you want to play a game like that yeah another one that really sticks out to me though that I want to mention is a good example is Ace Combat 7 all right cool which was one of the first games I covered this year and it still sticks with me and I think it might just end up on taking one of the spots on my annual game of the Year list at the end of this year really is uh I really like that game and I keep thinking about it but if you play it on the base system the experience was a lot less I guess you could say stable mmm this is kind of the recurring theme here right you’re either getting a lower maximum frame rate are you just getting significantly more slowdown and in that case it was okay but it just wasn’t that stable whereas on the pro pretty much the entire game with a few minor exceptions mm-hmm was locked at 60 frames per second which is how it was at least on the PlayStation 2 versions of those games I think there was a resolution advantage as well on ace combat 7 is that way or is my mind playing tricks I would need to go back and check on that to be sure it that’s non real engine full game right that’s right yes I sticking with that theme we have of course Tekken 7 and Soul Calibur 6 I believe yeah again those were 1080p on the pro lower resolution and I think slightly pared back effects on the base PlayStation 4 there so again I mean I’m I think the the big difference is definitely when you have those big frame rate jumps or better stability and performance but I still think that those games are just going to be better played on the throw than they are on the base unit and yeah I mean I think that’s pretty much the theme here that we’ve been setting is it’s either better performance better image quality or both yeah and yet native 1080p still looks really good on a 1080p screen so and it looks fine on a 4k screen as well but obviously you have to deal with upscaling at that point mm-hmm unless you have some way to scale that to 4k or you’re using one of Panasonic’s OLED TVs which do actually offer a nearest-neighbor scale oh really so you get the really sharp 1080p but I think they’re one of the only brands to offer that feature right yeah I mean just quickly another game that springs to mind I mean we could be here all day really but yeah I know exactly just calls for really pushes the bass playstation4 hard I haven’t played it since they patched in checkerboard rendering but when I played it at launch ps4 could go down to 720p the pro bottom doubt at 1080p and it was smoother to boot and in fact I seem to report at the time it was actually again the smoothest version of the game although the Xbox one X version really had a huge resolution upgrade bottom line the pro 1080p that 30fps line there I couldn’t really shift it so yeah another game there also I think we should be talking about maybe the first party games because I think there are some instances where the base unit stilled has you know really good performance and looks awesome spider-man I think is a great game but even there there are obviously resolution advantages on the pro and possibly slightly better stability I’m not sure about that yeah I think that’s actually the case it was slightly better seeing with days gone yeah same with games like horizon you know yeah horizon is actually really interesting because it had the 4k checkerboard mode which you could down scale to 1080p but it also had I don’t remember exactly what it was called but it was a stability mode where they basically ramped up the native resolution as far as they could go without any performance drops I think it was 13 65 P I might be wrong on that but it’s definitely in that area it was a strange resolution choice actually but it was above 1080p yeah so again you down scale from there you’re getting better image quality actually I think we should probably talk about checkerboard rendering yes instance and what that means on a 1080p screen well this is interesting isn’t it because when I was talking to Microsoft about the Xbox one x one of the engineers from the Advanced Technology Group says that you know these enhanced machines they’re great for 1080p screens because you’re getting in theory a maximum of four times super sampling and you know he never considered a day where they would be spending that much GPU resource his hond anti-aliasing but that’s what’s happened with this need to support 4k screens but with checkerboarding we have an interesting situation in that it’s almost like the image is first of all being up scaled and then it’s being down scaled again but I think by and large obviously it varies on a game by game basis but the image tends to hold up on a 4k screen and so when you’re down scaling still looks pretty good yeah I agree I found that the games that support downscaled checkerboarding or I guess you can still do with the system level the artifacts become rather difficult to see you know on the 1080p screen so you’re still getting the impression of a much higher native resolution basically super sampling so in that sense it really does make a difference I seem to recall like destiny to for instance looking really nice on a 1080p screen yeah I was at I was at somebody’s place and they were playing some destiny and on a 1080p plasma and it was just surprised at how clean it looks running on the pro at that resolution mmm whereas you know when you play it on a 4k screen the decent implementation but it is a little bit soft I think on the pro so that does kind of help clean up things it also works with games that use strong temporal anti-aliasing right where sometimes you know I like TAA it does clean up a lot of the motion artifacts but it can often appear rather soft and downscaling so if you have a higher resolution with TAA you downscaled at 1080p it does sort of it gives you the impression of a slightly sharper image just because there’s fewer pixels within the screen so it does kind of you still get that effect so it appears sharper but still very very clean you yeah in temporal stability obviously is off the scale I guess with both downsampling and oh yeah temporal super sampling as well yeah so I think one thing I do want to touch on cleveo is the system level super sampling so we you know obviously the big complaint we have back in the day and I still think it’s a really poor idea is this notion of locking particular performance profiles and resolution profiles to a front-end selection on the Pro either 1080p or 2160p is it just doesn’t seem right to me to you know essentially rely on the user reading digital foundry to find out about the difference or trying it themselves it just seems a bit odd to me but Sony did add a feature called obviously the super sampling feature which allows you to essentially tell the game that you’ve got a 4k screen even though you’ve got a 1080p screen and then it does the system level down scaling for you and from my perspective I think it’s nice that they added that feature but what’s kind of bothering me about it is that many games have double scaling now so I think the classic example I saw was Red Dead Redemption to where the checkerboarding wasn’t that great so obviously it’s expanding from 1920 by 2160 to 3840 by 2160 and then it’s down scaling it back to 1920 by 1080 and it kind of looks really soft notice the same thing also on Metal Gear Solid 5 when they did the pro patch for that that’s of native 1440p game and again you know it gets blowing up to 4k but then you know obviously the system level super sampling doesn’t know it’s been upscaled and then down scales it so you get this sort of it’s kind of more blurry than it should be but I guess you know they can’t actually access the game code to make the appropriate changes so we’re left with the double scaling there I was kind of hoping that once that feature was in place that guidance would be sent out to developers to actually support downscaling natively in the game but we still get titles where that isn’t the case yeah so I thought about this and one of the I don’t think the Sony would implement this but this really could be solved as sort of a sharpness slider you know I’m kind of like like on the Nvidia graphics cards when you use their built-in downsampling features right you sort of you can change how strongly the image is filtered to your preference basically I think just the the way that they filter the image does produce a rather blurry soft image when using that option which is why I notice when we look at games a lot of people are still asking hey does the game itself do downscaling or is it system level only and people care because it does impact the image and in fact I found that it’s most notice of one Hut elements yeah which become very soft when using the down scaling feature versus what you would natively get from the game normally okay so I don’t think we have a perfect solution here to this two mode video output business here but fundamentally I can’t help but think that if you really want the best 1080p gaming from your Playstation library we’ve reached the point now where Pro is the best place to be I don’t know what you think about that John yeah I mean honestly I think the Pro and the X in fact are both better for 1080p I just think that the X also works really well as a 4k console where the pro a little bit less so yeah yeah obviously I mean with the Xbox 1x you’ve got an even wider Delta between the base machine 2s and the enhanced machine DX but you know I think as he said earlier the X is doing a pretty bang-up job on accommodating 4k screens pretty nicely but again you know that would translates back to decent 1080p performance I guess but bottom line is that the pro can do is seems to have evolved into a sweet spot where it’s just a really good companion to a full HD screen absolutely I would agree I think it’s you know that that’s pretty much it right yeah I think that’s pretty nice so before we sign off here do you have any plans for next week that you’d like to share with the audience sure well my good friend audie from who I was often in our videos during e3 he is coming over to visit again and we are going to film more DF richer content on nice and possibly do maybe he’ll be a guest on the direct next week we’ll see that could be fun actually mix things up you know get some other discussion in here so yeah we’re gonna have that to look forward to yeah I got to see what else is is getting released and see if there’s anything we should be tackling next week but yeah probably do that I think Wolfenstein Youngblood is coming pretty soon consoles and PC is it yeah that’s right it’s coming out soon the console version console analysis from my perspective probably won’t be the most exciting since I expect it’ll be very similar to Wilson Stein to the new Colossus but I’m very curious to see what the ray-tracing stuff is on the PC side that is what’s exciting to me and I guess Alex will be looking at that and drooling all over it and you know maybe you have that third drin third gen rising at some points well of course Alex will be looking at valve which tight oh yeah both finish Stein and as for me well obviously we’ve got the 2080 Super next week out which I’m going to be taking a look at and beyond that that I’ve been doing some experiments kind of related to the next-gen consoles that producing some fascinating results can’t wait to share those it’s going to require a bit of work though so I do ask for your patience there beyond that Rison yeah I hope you’ve recovered from that a marathon a Verizon testing CPU testing is so fun isn’t it yeah that is indeed intense but you know we’ve got the risin 5 to look at always been an awesome price versus performance contender and I’m still really fascinated by the 12 core 3900 X we do have that here fascinated to see performance of that in gaming because obviously the multi-threaded task side of things is just going to be immense on that but can it hold up in gaming and it can’t wait to find out oh that’s the postman you can go ahead and well I’ll be right back yeah no II see what this is about got to admit when we first sat down to film this I kinda wasn’t expecting the day after work to be hijacked by Jon’s postman but let’s go with it oh this actually this could be funny part of the juice what hold on I’m coming back to the camera I’m all for special guests on digital fans redirect by the way if you’re interested in taking part postman are welcome to so this just in we I just got hijacked by the postman as you say so the end of our digital found redirect was interrupted what did we got here let’s do a little unboxing on camera just to see what we have in here come on let’s go free I mean this is taking scheduled content you’re a brand new direction that kind of thing I like it we need some really classy music for this all right so the first thing into that I have here is in fact a nice complete in box copy of Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles turtles in time for the Super Famicom look at that I’m just gonna so this is a great game and you know Ivan had a boxed version so there’s that now I’m gonna place that over here on the shelf next to our type 3 and rockman and forte so what’s this next box then oh this one’s this one to see it a little bit more what can I use to open that I know Alfred chicken for the Gameboy this has a sharp enough edge I’m gonna try to open this box use it out for chicken because that’s about all he’s good for you know out for chicken yeah I know Alfred check just fine a sort of picture of a focus group that came up with this particular name right well this is working a little bit I I wouldn’t do this with any other game except for Alfred chicken sorry Alfred chicken fans this is oh damn it John I’m not particularly looking forward to the massive alfred chicken backlash that this is going to produce see we haven’t done a lot of unboxing videos right so this is kind of like training if you will well you know I’m quite liking the idea of a new series unboxing with Alfred chicken could be YouTube Bob but I agree that’s about what he’s he’s the best for if you get if anybody likes our chicken please let me know in the comments because I’ve been trying to understand what’s up with that see now I’m literally just tearing through the boxes to get it undone it quickly I don’t really feel like dealing with this so come on John on tenterhooks a nice go for it oh wait let’s just we’re almost in is it gonna be exciting I think it’s a new game rather than a retro game but what’s it gonna be oh we’re in it is sigh very our Delta for the Nintendo switch this is a follow-up to a series that was on some classic systems Siberia r2 on Dreamcast there was a ps2 port I think but yeah I was happy to have a real physical copy of this here it is so we got this double unboxing here turtles in time sigh very our Delta there we go that this is the first official DF direct unboxing so I hope you guys enjoyed that completely random thing feeling I kind of think we all do so yes but I think that we’ll probably officially wrap it up now fair enough okay look enough of this nonsense if you did enjoy the content please do like and subscribe yes we’re wrapping up now and of course ring the bell for instant notifications whenever a new boundary drops be sure to follow us on Twitter and yes if you really like the work that John myself Alex and Tom do please do consider supporting us via the digital foundry patreon really makes a big difference but yeah we’re going to wrap this one up for now hopefully John’s postman will be available next week who knows anyway that’s all from us for now thanks for watching and we’ll see you next week